[djitchy]

Hello,

I've been having issues with my external strobe flash not firing lately. I haven't changed the setup lately, but for some reason it's happening more often.
It is extremely inconsistent and I cannot figure what is causing it. I have tried to narrow down the problem by swapping out the flash, camera, PC cable, and computer.

Setup info:

Canon Powershot G9 camera
SL-150 Monolight (connected via hot shoe adapter / PC cable) - I have not modified the hot shoe adapter (cut away a piece)
Built in flash is in the closed position (dial on camera is set to auto) could this be a problem?
Latest version of PS - Remote
-TV mode
-1/80
-ISO 100

Thanks in advance!

-J

[Amy Semmens]

Does the flash run on batteries? I have found that certain types of batteries or low quality brands cause the flash to misfire.
Also rechargables are inconsistent.
Hope that helps :)
Amy
The Party Pod



Hello,

I've been having issues with my external strobe flash not firing lately. I haven't changed the setup lately, but for some reason it's happening more often.
It is extremely inconsistent and I cannot figure what is causing it. I have tried to narrow down the problem by swapping out the flash, camera, PC cable, and computer.

Setup info:

Canon Powershot G9 camera
SL-150 Monolight (connected via hot shoe adapter / PC cable) - I have not modified the hot shoe adapter (cut away a piece)
Built in flash is in the closed position (dial on camera is set to auto) could this be a problem?
Latest version of PS - Remote
-TV mode
-1/80
-ISO 100

Thanks in advance!

-J

[djitchy]

Hi Amy,

The flash is actually plugged in to a standard outlet.



Does the flash run on batteries? I have found that certain types of batteries or low quality brands cause the flash to misfire.
Also rechargables are inconsistent.
Hope that helps :)
Amy
The Party Pod

[alexsiskahn]

"(dial on camera is set to auto) could this be a problem?"

possibly, set it to manual and see.

[photo_ells]

I know you have tried swapping the sync lead but have you tried a new hotshoe adapter?

Also have you got a slave function set on the strobe? If so turn it off, if it can't be turned off cover the cell with gaffer/duct tape. You may be getting other people's flashes firing off yours so it isnt recycling in time for your shot. i have seen this happen before from DJ strobes and even flickering flouresent lights too!

[sspbooth]

I'm assuming you don't have a spare flash to test?

[Chris Breeze]

Try setting the flash setting in the main PSRemote window to "Off" so that the built-in flash doesn't fire.

BTW The position of the dials on the camera don't have any effect when a PowerShot camera is connected to a PC.

[onebadhobbit]

I feel your pain, I seem to forever be trying out new formations, as I have had similar problems. From what I can tell on line, PC sync adapters have a bad reputation. i just purchased some replacement options. Testing them out this weekend.
http://strobist.blogspot.co.nz/2010/02/its-time-for-pc-jack-to-die.html

And yes, keeping an eye that your slave is not being triggered is a good move too.

Cheers.

Dion

[jayredliner]

I've also had this problem. My flash firing is inconsistent for no apparent reason. Some days it works, some it doesn't. Could be that PC Sync cables are the worst thing ever invented. My next attempt will be to try wireless triggering.

[djitchy]

Thanks for all of your responses. I just wanted to update you all. I replaced the hot shoe adapter and that seemed to do the trick. I never suspected it to be the problem because it seems like such a simple piece of equipment that wouldn't 'go bad'.

[xr4ti]

I'm suspecting that I had a similar issue tonight. I helped my attendants set up at a reception, since I was nearby and had some free time. Anyhow we got the booth open early since we got set up so quick (should have took our time, lol!) I leave after about 20 sessions. Then I got a call that the some of the pictures were not turning out. Just about every session had misfires, some with just the first pic, some with two misfires (and the BRIDE was in that one, ouch) one had all 3. So, I go back onsite to see what's going on, they are swapping in the spare G10 (first time I've ever had to use it!) So I give the photo booth a reboot, and we re-seat all the cables. I stayed for about 45 more sessions and the flash only misfired once. (3 picture layout). So, fingers are crossed for the rest of the night, hope I don't get another call.

The hot shoe adaptor is one of those Chinese ebay ones, but my cable is hard wired into the adaptor, no PC connector. The other end is a standard 3.5mm headphone jack to my Alienbee's strobe. On my own booth, with the same equipment and settings, I'll get a flash misfire once, maybe twice *tops* at an event where 100+ sessions are taken. (~350 photos). It never happened enough to worry over it, but tonight was a real shocker.

This is the first issue I've had with this particular booth, it's in full time custody of these attendants and they've done about 30 events with it this year. Perhaps after the next event I'll take it back and go through everything, check all the cables, etc..

We swapped the camera, but I suspect that the flash or cabling is at fault because I can still see the subjects in the photos, just really dark. (f/5.6, 1/125, ISO 100, 'Flash' white balance) Probably time to upgrade the way I do flash sync..

I did notice that some of the guests kept slamming the stealthswitch repeatedly after the session started, thinking they need to press it for each photo. I only have 1 button configured on stealthswitch, it's the left mouse click. No other autohotkeys or anything else automated. Pretty simple setup. I've tried getting my own booth to act up by continually pressing the stealthswitch, but never had negative results.

...It's kind of like my UP-DR200 that ONLY jams when I'm at an event where mostly young kids are there, fighting over the prints. (Therefore crowding the printer and having the first print stay partially lodged in the printer as it's trying to eject....

Is the season almost over yet? :)

[apples]

xr4ti

You really need to assess your set up - something is wrong . . .. .

You are accepting a 3 to 4% failure rate on your photos which is far too high. I remember we had a 'black' photo at an event back in December . . .. . that was due to an old studio flash unit malfunctioning . . . .. we switched to a different make flash in that booth, it has now probably done 30,000+ flashes and not 1 black photo. That is normal for a booth set-up.

Occasionally during set-up we have to refix the hotshoe adapter - maybe at 1 in 10 events - it probably loosens during transport, as we travel with camera/flash/monitor still in the rig.

[xr4ti]

xr4ti

You really need to assess your set up - something is wrong . . .. .

You are accepting a 3 to 4% failure rate on your photos which is far too high. I remember we had a 'black' photo at an event back in December . . .. . that was due to an old studio flash unit malfunctioning . . . .. we switched to a different make flash in that booth, it has now probably done 30,000+ flashes and not 1 black photo. That is normal for a booth set-up.

Occasionally during set-up we have to refix the hotshoe adapter - maybe at 1 in 10 events - it probably loosens during transport, as we travel with camera/flash/monitor still in the rig.

Figured out what it was, one of the conductive bands around the flash tube was broken, and I assume depending on how far the flash unit was tilted, it was making or breaking the connection. It might have been weak / partially broken for some time now, (attribution to an occasional misfire), but then it finally worked itself completely loose after so many haul ins to events. So, 4 new flash tubes on order!

[Dani]

xr4ti - When you say, "The hot shoe adaptor is one of those Chinese ebay ones, but my cable is hard wired into the adaptor, no PC connector" which cable are you referring to, the one that powers the camera, or one that connects to a phono jack to the Alien bees?

Since you think it is the connection bands in the flash tube, how do you explain the misfires from your other booth?

We have also had misfires where you can see the subjects in the photos, but very dark. This indicates to me that the camera is being triggered by PS remote, but like you said probably something with "flash or cabling....maybe it is time to upgrade the way I do flash sync." If you hadn't detected the connection band problem, what steps would you have taken to check the cabling and flash? Just wondering what you mean. If power to your strobe and camera is intact, then the only cabling is between the hotshoe adapter and the phono jack on the Alien bees, right?

We have had a heck of a time recently with misfires and software glitches. We run Canon S5 IS powershots with Windows XP, PS remote v. 2.1 and 2.2 (2 booths). We run Manual mode, ISO 80, 1/250, Av 8. We started with a hotshoe adapter (cheap kind) connected via sync cord. Our misfire rate last season was approximately 1 or 2 per 150 sessions (3 frames per strip so about 450 images with a 1% failure rate), but this only happened 1 or 2 times in over 25 events for our first season.

Our set up does include manipulating the hotshoe to "believe" that it had an on camera flash (my partner did this, not exactly sure how it works but this is how he describes it to me; sorry don't have more details). We only buy "nearly new" S5 cameras off of Ebay. Recently, we had an event where we couldn't get our strobe to sync with our camera at all. We identified our hotshoe adapter to hotshoe connection as the culprit so ran our strobe as a pure slave unit for that event. We had 4 misfires which I think can be explained by other flash units triggering our strobe, though our strobe has a quick recycling speed of 1.3 seconds. Believing that all of this may be due to a bad hotshoe connection and/or problematic "tricking of the hotshoe", we outfitted the booth with a radio sync unit (brand: Microsync). We also purchased a new booth with the exact same set up including brand new Bowen gemini 200ws and nearly new S5. We were shocked to find that failure rate and randomness was similar to before - one booth (old booth) ran with no misfires for 600+ shots, while the other one experiences 4-5 misfires. Then, the next weekend, the old booth that had no failures previously, now experienced 6 misfires, and the 2nd booth experienced 2.

Our other thought is that we are completely pushing the limits of the S5 by using too fast a shutter speed. We run at 1/250 which may be overboard. A website I found stated the "The S5 can sync as fast as 1/250 sec with an external flash." Is it assumed, then, that a studio strobe would increase speeds? I could not find the "sync speed" capacity of the Bowen gemini 200 WS, but maybe "sync speed" is a limitation of the camera, not the strobe. There are 2 reasons why I question the shutter speed as the culprit here.....First, last weekend we ran our booth "manually". We had a complete system melt-down (read my other post regarding camera not being able to connect to Ps Remote). It was really lame, but at least I could still take photos, print them after the fact, and provide a web gallery from the images saved to the card. However, what I learned is that when I increased the shutter speed to 1/500 (just playing around between subjects), I could trigger the strobe every time when I used it as a pure slave. I played around with various shutter speeds and the only time I got misfiring is when I used the Microsync radio slaving. Is there something about radio syncing that reduces the flash syncing speed even further? Or, is anyone using radio syncing with problems due to metal and interference within the small body of the booth?

I guess all of this is so perplexing because we had done over 25 events last season with the same set up (including 1/250 shutter speed using sync cable) and had only 1 or 2 total events with misfires. Sometimes we wonder if the S5 (or any powershot with a hotshoe for that matter) is simply not designed for use with a studio strobe. I guess the only thing to try is reducing the shutter speeds to 1/60 or 1/100 and see if we get misfires, both with slave and radio trigger. If the problem continues, switch to an SLR and DSLR remote pro? This makes me wonder if folks that are having misfires are using point and shoots? Are people getting misfires with SLRs?

So overall here is the bullet list of what we've tried or thought about:

--strobe recycling speed too slow or not synched with camera when strobe is pre-triggered by other flash units
--hotshoe adapter to sync cord cabling or connection problems
--shutter speed too fast
--radio slave further reduces syncing speed
--S5 IS simply cannot "handle" hotshoe-enabled studio strobe shooting, whether sync cord or radio sync

The one thing I haven't gotten to learn about yet is if wireless syncing (e.g. radio syncing) is problematic if the camera produces a "pre-flash". I just read about this under the "Wireless Syncing" section of this Wiki article: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flash_synchronization where it states that:
"One of the problems with optical triggering is that in modern digital cameras a built-in or shoemount flash releases one or more 'pre-flashes'. Many optical slave units will respond to the pre-flash, thus firing the slave flash too early. Sometimes this can be prevented by setting the camera to manual ('M'). However, a good number of cameras will still fire pre-flashes even on a manual setting. This is equally true for compact cameras as well as the more professional digital SLR cameras. Still, a flash connected to the PC jack on a camera or in the hotshoe will usually not fire pre-flashes in the 'M' setting and therefore can be used to optically trigger a number of slave flashes." Has anybody experienced this or suspected this with their misfires? If so, what camera are you using and what type of wireless synching?


Finally, I just wanted to comment on what others have said regarding misfires with slave sensing units. It is my understanding that when a phono jack is plugged into the female phono receptor of a studio strobe, the slave sensor is disabled. If true, it shouldn't matter what other flashes are going off nearby.

I'm sorry for the longest post in the universe. This situation has truly befuddled us. Before sinking money into upgrading our cameras, we would love to hear from any of you. Much thanks.

[Dani]

Another thought is that since the software drives the triggering of the camera, this is the break in the chain somehow. If true, would PS remote still produce a 3-post strip if, say, frame #2 was not triggered by PS remote? I don't know the answer to this. I do know that some of our misfires you can see the faint image of the subjects in the frame. On other misfires, you can see nothing, pure blackness. To me, this indicates either software not triggering camera, or room was too dark to allow for any light to come through, though we always have the same set up inside the booth (LEDs light the studio near the camera lense).

[djitchy]

I'm suspecting that I had a similar issue tonight. I helped my attendants set up at a reception, since I was nearby and had some free time. Anyhow we got the booth open early since we got set up so quick (should have took our time, lol!) I leave after about 20 sessions. Then I got a call that the some of the pictures were not turning out. Just about every session had misfires, some with just the first pic, some with two misfires (and the BRIDE was in that one, ouch) one had all 3. So, I go back onsite to see what's going on, they are swapping in the spare G10 (first time I've ever had to use it!) So I give the photo booth a reboot, and we re-seat all the cables. I stayed for about 45 more sessions and the flash only misfired once. (3 picture layout). So, fingers are crossed for the rest of the night, hope I don't get another call.

The hot shoe adaptor is one of those Chinese ebay ones, but my cable is hard wired into the adaptor, no PC connector. The other end is a standard 3.5mm headphone jack to my Alienbee's strobe. On my own booth, with the same equipment and settings, I'll get a flash misfire once, maybe twice *tops* at an event where 100+ sessions are taken. (~350 photos). It never happened enough to worry over it, but tonight was a real shocker.

This is the first issue I've had with this particular booth, it's in full time custody of these attendants and they've done about 30 events with it this year. Perhaps after the next event I'll take it back and go through everything, check all the cables, etc..

We swapped the camera, but I suspect that the flash or cabling is at fault because I can still see the subjects in the photos, just really dark. (f/5.6, 1/125, ISO 100, 'Flash' white balance) Probably time to upgrade the way I do flash sync..

I did notice that some of the guests kept slamming the stealthswitch repeatedly after the session started, thinking they need to press it for each photo. I only have 1 button configured on stealthswitch, it's the left mouse click. No other autohotkeys or anything else automated. Pretty simple setup. I've tried getting my own booth to act up by continually pressing the stealthswitch, but never had negative results.

...It's kind of like my UP-DR200 that ONLY jams when I'm at an event where mostly young kids are there, fighting over the prints. (Therefore crowding the printer and having the first print stay partially lodged in the printer as it's trying to eject....

Is the season almost over yet? :)


Great Points Dani. Any updates/new information?
We had 2 events this weekend. One on Friday, the other on Saturday. The Friday event went very smoothly with no problems. However, on Saturday, the booth had a 'meltdown' . Towards the last hour of operation, it started 'misfiring' again. I noticed that the camera would take a picture, but the flash did not trigger. This happened quite often. Sometimes 2 out of the 4 pictures per session had a misfire.

About 5 minutes after the misfires started, our Mitsubishi Dye Sub printer started to print 'red' pictures and cut 6 x 6 (instead of the normal 4x6)

I don't know what is going on. The problems are so inconsistent.

Can anyone help?

[Chris Breeze]

The most likely reason for the flash not firing is problems with the connection between the camera and the flash. You should be able to verify that the camera was set properly by looking at the EXIF data of the images e.g. the EXIF data from a Canon Rebel series camera using external flash mode should show M exposure mode and a shutter speed of 1/200 sec.

It's hard to say what could be causing the printer problems but one possibility is that the equipment might be overheating during the event. There's almost certainly a hardware problem if the settings in the printer driver are OK but don't match what the printer is doing. You can check the printer settings that the photobooth software is using by selecting "Printer setup..." from the File menu.

[BoothsRus]

We have had this happen also. I replaced the shoe and the cable and it stopped. Im not sure which one it was but I was glad to stop it!!

BAU

[djitchy]

The most likely reason for the flash not firing is problems with the connection between the camera and the flash. You should be able to verify that the camera was set properly by looking at the EXIF data of the images e.g. the EXIF data from a Canon Rebel series camera using external flash mode should show M exposure mode and a shutter speed of 1/200 sec.

It's hard to say what could be causing the printer problems but one possibility is that the equipment might be overheating during the event. There's almost certainly a hardware problem if the settings in the printer driver are OK but don't match what the printer is doing. You can check the printer settings that the photobooth software is using by selecting "Printer setup..." from the File menu.

Would a shutter speed of 1/60 cause an issue? I looked at the exif data and noticed we are shooting at 1/60.

[CheekyPix]

Ive also had a lot of issues with flash misfires.
Some days it would be fine, others days a non-stop headache.

Flash sync cables and hot shoe adapters seem to be at fault most of the time, generally the quality of both is pretty poor, ive got through dozens of each in the last year.

Also found cheaper flash heads send back to much voltage too the cameras which they really don't like.

I switched to wireless flash triggers a few months ago and have had no problems since.

The camera sender is battery powered, still on the same set of batteries after 30+ events.
The flash head receiver/trigger is mains powered so no need to worry about that end.

[djitchy]

Ive also had a lot of issues with flash misfires.
Some days it would be fine, others days a non-stop headache.

Flash sync cables and hot shoe adapters seem to be at fault most of the time, generally the quality of both is pretty poor, ive got through dozens of each in the last year.

Also found cheaper flash heads send back to much voltage too the cameras which they really don't like.

I switched to wireless flash triggers a few months ago and have had no problems since.

The camera sender is battery powered, still on the same set of batteries after 30+ events.
The flash head receiver/trigger is mains powered so no need to worry about that end.

I think I may look into going wireless... How would one of these wireless flash triggers connect to a monolight?

[CheekyPix]

something like this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/433MHz-Wireless-Studio-Flash-RT-16-16-Channel-Trigger-and-Receiver-/190641802696?pt=UK_CamerasPhoto_CameraAccessories_ CameraFlashUnits_JN&hash=item2c63230dc8

[CheekyPix]

One point I should make..

I was at a job a few months ago and the flash head was firing off all over the place by itself.

After numerous checks to make sure everything was OK, replacing batteries, swapping out camera etc we finally discovered that it was the photographer in the room next door triggering our flashes with his remote that was on the same channel.

His flash heads had also been going off every time someone used the booth.

A quick change of channel and problem solved.

[djitchy]

Hello everyone. I just want to revisit/update you all on this issue. The last action I took was to replace the flash hotshoe adapter which seemed to fix the problem. We were able to do 10+ events without any misfires (black images) . However, at an event last night (3 hour), we had 2 misfires. Does anyone have any thoughts or new information regarding this issue?





Hello,

I've been having issues with my external strobe flash not firing lately. I haven't changed the setup lately, but for some reason it's happening more often.
It is extremely inconsistent and I cannot figure what is causing it. I have tried to narrow down the problem by swapping out the flash, camera, PC cable, and computer.

Setup info:

Canon Powershot G9 camera
SL-150 Monolight (connected via hot shoe adapter / PC cable) - I have not modified the hot shoe adapter (cut away a piece)
Built in flash is in the closed position (dial on camera is set to auto) could this be a problem?
Latest version of PS - Remote
-TV mode
-1/80
-ISO 100

Thanks in advance!

-J

[Chris Breeze]

Hello everyone. I just want to revisit/update you all on this issue. The last action I took was to replace the flash hotshoe adapter which seemed to fix the problem. We were able to do 10+ events without any misfires (black images) . However, at an event last night (3 hour), we had 2 misfires. Does anyone have any thoughts or new information regarding this issue?

The fact that replacing the hotshoe adapter fixed the problem for 10+ events before having the problem again strongly suggests that it is a hardware problem probably with the hotshoe adapter or the cable connecting it to the flash.

[Dani]

Hello everyone. I just want to revisit/update you all on this issue. The last action I took was to replace the flash hotshoe adapter which seemed to fix the problem. We were able to do 10+ events without any misfires (black images) . However, at an event last night (3 hour), we had 2 misfires. Does anyone have any thoughts or new information regarding this issue?

djitchy, I feel your pain man!!! yes, we have updates! I ended up finding the "answer" by searching and searching and posting and posting on digital camera sites, not photo booth sites. email flash zebra, lon. explain your situation, link your posts. the pc sync cord is the worst connection in the history of mankind. it is true. he has different connectors between your camera and your studio strobe. this is the problem, knock on wood!!